It's an issue we've discussed a few times on the blog and I'm sure we undoubtedly will again because it is the elephant in the fashionably decorated room that just will.not.go.away. regardless of how much we all want it to. And believe me, we want it to. To be perfectly honest darlings, I hate talking and hearing about it and I'm bored of the whole thing, i'm sure you are too which is why I rarely post anything about it. But every once in a while I read or hear something that still provokes a strong enough reaction in me to want to rant to you guys. Case in point, an online article on British Fashion Magazine Grazia's website about comments French blogger extraordinaire Garance Doré made regarding the use of plus size models in the industry.
You can see the full article here but the gist of it is the journalist criticizing Garance (right) as being "more unpalatable than an ill-fitting kaftan top with her rigid views" over these comments she made to an Austrailian magazine:
"I think it's too much and almost naive of the fashion industry, because it would be nice in a few years that the idea of different body shapes is normal, but right now it's not quite there yet."
"It should not be such a big deal to show women with different bodies, but sometimes it's treated like a bit of joke, or for shock, like the plus sized models on the runway (Mark Fast) in the UK fashion week".
"It's not such a good thing to show plus size because it's not really physically healthy and not always flattering to fashion."
You may see something completely different and agree with the writer but personally I don't have that much of a problem with what she said. At all. Not only is she entitled to her opinion, but she does have a point; being overweight, (which is often what the plus sized models that are used are, rather than just being curvy and healthy) is just as unhealthy as the underweight norm in the industry, and sad as it is, most clothes do look better on the runway on 'clothes hanger' models. And whilst I think it may have come out a little more insenstive than intended (she is French after all), I do see where she is coming from on her other points as well.
A few months ago when I did a post about V Magazine's 'Size Issue' (right) where they used only plus-sized models, the overwhelming majority of you agreed with me that it was nothing more than a gimmick that wouldn't change anything and that rather than being a compliment was actually offensive to curvy girls everywhere.I also don't think Garance has anything against curvier girls as the journalist insinuates she does, "Really Garance, no one is going to make you put fat girls in your work, and as for all the others, they’re not doing you any harm are they?" I just think she is being realistic, brutally honest and incredibly aware of the workings of the industry she loves. If only the same could be said for Naomi.
The hypocrisy of the journalist Naomi Atwood is shocking; slating Garance Doré in one article for saying plus size models don't always work in fashion, which if we're honest is (not always but often) true, and in another article, Marc Jacobs - Size Hero?, which I almost wrote about but (just about) restrained myself, she's praising Marc Jacobs (the love of my life who can do absolutely no wrong) for using much larger girls on his catwalk and congratulating him for being a trendsetter who is championing the return of big girls with curves. Um. Is it just me who doesn't see any curves in the photos she used (below) to demonstrate her point? Marc is undeniably a style hero, that's a given, but a 'Size Hero', as his biggest fan even i'm not so sure...These pictures to me, if anything, confirm exactly what Garance was saying. Yes, it will be nice even normal to one day have many different body-types in the industry, but we're not there yet, and we won't be for a very very very long time. We're moving at a glacial pace and such a huge change that is so crucial to an industry based on superficial, external beauty, simply cannot, or more to the point, will not be rushed. And the sooner the industry is honest about it's prejudices and reluctance as Garance was, the sooner change will occur.
So what do you think darlings, does Garance have a point or are you pro-Plus at all costs?
Stay safe and chic mes chéries,
English Rose x







Really interesting topic to discuss. Nice work :) Have an immense week mon amie :)
ReplyDelete-The Trendy Fashionista
http://thetrendyfashionista.blogspot.com
interesting topic ^^ i think they should be a range of differet size models
ReplyDeleteAmazing like always♥!!!
ReplyDeletehttp://fashionteens101.blogspot.com
I'm glad you had a wonderful birthday! Congrats on turning 18. :P
ReplyDeleteGreat post, as always. I think there should be plus sized models. They're gorgeous and represent the majority of the population. They're not fat, they're NORMAL. xoxo
I think fashion is supposed to entice people, sell people on clothing and ideas... No matter what size the model is.
ReplyDeleteIf it looks good on a thinner girl, let her sell the product.
If it looks good on a curvier lady, let her promote it.
Who cares about "plussize" or "skinnyass" labels? A model is a model is a model.
I think right now, people are taking it too far with trying to "show off", let's say, the fact that they have put plussized models in their show or in print. I mean, what is such a big achievement about that? They're all just models. It's making a big deal out of nothing. I think some people in the industry want to rid the world of the notion that models are "always anorexic"... but putting in "plus sized" models just to get rid of that preconception is not a good idea. It's just making up another preconception to distract the former.
You're so talented, and I love your writing style!
ReplyDeleteVery interesting post! I totally agree with your epilogue:)
Wishing you a great day!
Betty xx
Another nice post.
ReplyDeleteFirstly, happy belated birthday!
Secondly, I don't really have anything against the journalist. What she says is pretty reasonable. It's just not acceptable for maybe some people. You know, sometimes people get angry for hearing the truth due to humiliation?
Happy Belated Birthday darling!!
ReplyDeleteThis is a topic I too am sick to the teeth of. Change will come, but it will be slow in coming. However, Esquire magazine has crowned Christina Hendricks as their sexiest woman of the year, a move in the right direction (and a very, very good choice!).
Yes,Happy belated birthday!I`m glad to see that you had fun!
ReplyDeleteI am linking you :)
P.S.You are a great writer!
Awesome post!
ReplyDeleteI love your writing style an i agree with you one hundred percent. Honestly, i would be shocked if they used models like her on an everyday basis.. It just doesnt seem like.. Fashion, without the waif thin models sadly :(
Love Beckah x
http://notesfromtheundergroundteen.blogspot.com
I love seeing curvier girls in magazines, it's much more inspiring than the stick thin models, for me anyway...
ReplyDeletetweet tweet tweet
x
Is it terribly bad blogging ettiquiet (i can't spell lol) on my part that I'm not too sure what exchange links is? Do you mean I link you on my blog and you do on mine?
ReplyDeleteAh i sound so incompetent!
xx
for the last time world, WE DONT NEED PLUS SIZE MODELS.... WE NEED NORMAL SIZE MODELS.
ReplyDeleteWell, it's good to have every kind of size or things would be boring =) Thanks for stopping by. So not my day today =S
ReplyDelete=Berlin=
Garance does have a point. Being overweight is unhealthy (and unsightly). Very thought-provoking post, darling!
ReplyDeletexoxox,
CC
you have the most insightful and tactful way with words darling, wise beyond your years <3
ReplyDeletei love your blog! i think models-and all women-are beautiful the way they are, no matter their size, so i'd love to see curvier models in magazines. I'm not against skinny models, but i think that there should be more variety of sizes in the media :)
ReplyDeletethanks for the comment + id love to exchange links :)
xx
http://retroloving.blogspot.com/
I'm split on this issue, I think the point you made about the clothes sit better on stick-thin modelws is true but mainly because the designers make them to sit better on those particular models. High fashion appeals at the moment to only a portion of people. If a young girl who is not exactly thin but perfectly healthy teenager that becomes interested in fashion there is a high chance she could become slightly disheartened by the lack of appearances on the catwalk from models that have her body type and even when they're are they are over-publicised for the wrong reasons and here we have 'real woman' garb again. A real woman is every woman not just the person that looks like you!
ReplyDeleteFrom Dolly
XXX
http://dollydaydreamsdomicile.blogspot.com/
I think the problem is that if you use people who are 'curvy' just to make a point then that is an insult to people of that size/shape etc. Fashion needs to be representative, Danni and I couldn't be more different, she is tall and slim (size 8) and I am short and curvy (size 14) yet we are both healthy. Until you have people of all shapes, sizes and colours on the catwalks then photoshoots like this are gimmicky and insulting.
ReplyDeleteMaria xxx
I'm with you and Garance. "Overweight" does not equal "curvy and healthy".
ReplyDeleteI also agree that featuring a spread with plus size models doesn't change a thing. A "revolution" would be repeatedly featuring them alongside standardly thin models.
I don't like how the media is imposing beauty standards upon people because it makes people think they're not OK the way they are, but on the other hand being a model is a job like any other and if the requirement is being (below) a certain size, I don't see a problem with it because other jobs have requirements too. This is an issue that will probably confuse me forever.
I have to agree with Garance. As much as we would like to say that all sizes are being embraced and thought of as beautiful; at this point in time, it's not the truth. People still seek out thinner girls when it comes to fashion. Perhaps some years down the line this will change; but, at the moment, that is how things are.
ReplyDeleteCongratulations on turning 18, my love! Hope you had a marvelous birthday full of sparkle and fun!! :)
Hello darling♥
ReplyDeleteAm loving this long and interesting and controversial post, I agree with Garance 100% yes we all want to be healthy right? that’s all Garance is saying. If someone is over weight it only means they eat to much sweets and white breads, which lead to the most dangerous of sicknesses. I have many nutritionists in my family so health is a priority in my life….I personally have friends that are curvy but they definitely don’t look a bit like those models they’re just a bit thick boned. This issue Provokes so much hypocrisy in people example: Many girls say Gosh that model is so skinny or all the Victoria Secret Models are anorexic ewwwwk! That looks so gross!!……But the same girls will rant about how unhappy they are about their body and mentioning they wish they looked like one of the models they just said they hated ……I don’t understand!! …. Clothing those look better in thin models, that doesn’t mean it wont look good in a normal size girl.. Thin models is what the industry has always been about and am sure it wont change any time soon!……
Like you said this issue is moving in a very glacial pace….But what we should all talk about is health! Health is what’s important, and this applies to the extreme thin and Plus size models.
Amazing post darling love your point of view!!!!♥…sending all my love♥
wow, heavy (oh man, pardon the pun). I'm pro healthy! It's kind of depressing when you watching fashion reality shows and models are told they are too fat to be a model but too skinny to be a "plus sized model" WTF?
ReplyDeleteHola que tal te dejo mi sitio web de alta costura y mi recien inagurado blog de Corsets para que lo visites:
ReplyDeleteSaludos y gracias!!
http://corsets-jesica-kulesz.blogspot.com
http://www.jesicakulesz.com.ar
Glad yoo had a fun birthday. I think this 'plus size' concept is really catching on and maybe for some few its great to see normal chubbier people modeling their fav clothes off...
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletepromoting obesity is one thing, but showing that a model doesn't have to be a size 2 to be beautiful is another. being a size 10 doesn't doom you to death, but there is also the health nut in me that also knows that as the size/scale goes up so does the risk for heart disease and other problems...
ReplyDeleteBUT that's not the issue...
the industry has promoted unhealthy - too skinny- too young girls for decades... so health has NOTHING to do with fashion. it's just a way for small minded designers to avoid having to design for real women.
lovely post. this topic has been bugging me lately.
http://laurenlanzaosias.blogspot.com
be a follower, not a hater
yes lets exchange links! if i havent done it by sunday pls tell me off xoxoxox
ReplyDeleteThese models are lovely, plus size is finally getting note worthy shine!
ReplyDeleteWould love to link exchange if your interested.
http://truequeen.com
I think that Garance is right. As much as I would like to see more plus-sized models on the runways and in the photo shoots, it is important to be aware that the mindset of the fashion industry has to change in order for this to be possible. Great post!!!
ReplyDeleteI love this article, and I, probably unlike anyone else, never tire of hearing about plus-size girls. I agree with you that plus size will take to work into the industry, but I love the idea of a show with both skinny girls, normal girls and plus size girls. I have toadmit I'm fascinated by the skinny girls, and I know it's unhealthy but I just can't help it... Lovely post as usual (:
ReplyDeleteOh, and just so you know, I will be linking you on my blog from now on (:
stay lovely
xx
prettylittlecottonroses.blogspot.com
Another well-written and intelligent post!! I think this size issue is beaten to death by now and I'm so tired of it actually but I'm with Garance on this! She's not offending anyone and she's just saying the truth and her opinion about it. To me, the writers in Grazia likes to flare up drama about nothing and they're so pretentious and blind to what fashion is all about. It's about appreciating the beautiful clothes and not putting down the way designers chose to display their hard work! There! that's my opinion :-) xxoxoxoxoxoxo
ReplyDeleteI totally agree that I would like to see versatility on the runways/ magazines, etc. Still I also think that this will not happen (in the nearer future) at least on the runways. I would like magazines to switch to different sizes... they can still do retouching, what they already do with the "skinny" models. Well, in the end, I think one should just try not to be influenced too much by so called role models... we are just different. Great post, again!!
ReplyDelete*Nathalie
Great post! Personally I agree with Garance.
ReplyDeleteI think she is getting a bad rap mainly because people like to give others a hard time when they start to get popular. It would be nice to see all kinds of models eventually one day. But curvy is so much different than being over weight and super skinny is not healthy either. Marc Jacobs models are not curvy at all, they just look like healthy woman. They are defiantly NOT plus size. actually most woman the industry calls plus size are not big girls at all, they just don't look emaciated. Great post and great blog we are following now. And Happy Birthday!
XX
Abutterflybyday.blogspot.com
You know what, I kinda agree with Garance. It would be lovely to have a better representation of all sizes on runways and magazines but she is right, realistically this isn't going to happen now. As you pointed out, at the moment it does happen but it's totally a gimmick, like the all black Vogue Italia issue. Yes, these gimmicks have bought the issue out to the fore, but nothing has really changed...yet
ReplyDeleteLove the post, and love twiggy:)
ReplyDeletei could go on about this for hours, but summed up i believe that fashion is MEANT to be something to aspire to and something that girls WANT to be. it's fair enough that people are comfortable with their bodies whatever their size, but what V did was definately a gimmick, which i believe was quite insensitive. most girls i know want to be thinner and although i do believe that it can be taken too far, the thinner models are more of what girls want to be than say, a plus size model. also, clothing is made in sample sizes and so is therefore alot easier for magazines etc to find the clothing for a smaller size model than it is for plus size. it all comes down to opinion, but i doubt plus size models will ever be the phenominon that thinner models are.
ReplyDeletegreat read, very thought provoking as you can probably tell!
xxx
loved reading this. it's a pretty weird area of debate, i have to say.
ReplyDeletesweet blog!
loving your posts.
stop by some time xx
I hope you enjoyed your trip to the theatre. I saw Les Mis a few years ago with my lovely mummy. It was such a fantastic production, very powerful and moving.
ReplyDeleteYou saw Twiggy! I love Twiggy, what a perfect suprise gift for your birthday.
I was watching the Quantum of Solace the other day with my friend, in one particular scene, some scantily clad girly walked in to show Daniel Craig a thing or two. My friend took one look at her and gagged on his food. He was schocked at figure, which in his opinion was quite underweight. He is a gorgeous bodybuilder, who also crries out personal training for men and women. As someone one who of course advocates, good health, he regards the emaciated skeletal models on the catwalk, as being very unhealthy. It is also possible to be plus size and healthy. In fact a few of my male friends positively drool over larger ladies and won't give a second glance to anyone under a size 14.
I totally agree with you, it is an uphill struggle, for the industry as well as society to accept plus size models, but a struggle worth going for.
great post!!! xoxo
ReplyDeleteanother woman by rose
Twiggy! OMG! I would've been pretty excited myself. Glad you had a good birthday. You may be 18 but wait until you're 20 - that's when it finally dawns on you that you're old!
ReplyDeleteAs for an opinion on pro-plus... weeeeell. I've never been too sure which side I'm on. I'm like the switzerland of this battle. I mean, 500 years ago it was beautiful to be chubby and have no breasts. Everyone was painted in portraits that way - I'm sure the skinnier people, or the more busty women were annoyed. It's an era thing. No doubt in 500 years time it may be popular for women to be hairy again. Gross idea now, but then.. who knows!? As for now, I think people should stop worrying about it, particularly if they're a parent and worrying about the impression it leaves on their child. After all - a child's biggest role model is their parent. They should worry about how they're acting in front of their kid instead of what the media is doing... the media is unstoppable, I'll tell you now!
U always discuss really interesting topics hun and I respect you for that : ) Hope u are having a lovely wknd xx
ReplyDeleteThese plus sized models are not unhealthy?
ReplyDeleteI have seen some serious overweight and unhealthy people in my job. aAd these girls don't look like that. some people are just meant to be a bigger size. I think the issue here is the fact we are making issue of it. if we always had a variety of gorgeous girls in all shapes and sizes no one would bat an eye-lid.
http://aforteforfashion.blogspot.com
Happy to hear about your birthday! =)
ReplyDeleteI think htat plus models don't sell; however it is dangerous what we are doing as consumers: enforcing the cyclical ideal of using unhealthy models. It is dangerous to our own well beings, but the well being of the models. Their health is in serious peril and they are in an industry that does not provide medical benefits in most cases. I also lust after "model thing legs" and can let the images I see cloud my vision when I am judging myself. Now, I am healthy and am not saying I am partaking in unhealthy eating habits, however I am not free from self doubt.
Loving fashion and not loving the industry is at times a conflict of interest.
It is an interesting topic, that's for sure. I personally agree that yes, it is just a gimmick BUT I *hate* when people say that being 'overweight" is unhealthy. As a family with many doctors and nutritionists, its not "unhealthy" to be overweight, and certainly the girls that are walking the runways are not obese. It is unhealthy to lead an unhealthy life style. Health comes in a variety of shapes and sizes, but unfortunate its only equated with the skinny ideal. Those plus-sized models that walk the runways are not obese in any way, shape or form, so they should never be labeled as that. Fashion is built upon the premise of affluence and being unattainable, and having a normal body just doesn't meld well with the doctrine that fashion follows.
ReplyDeleteYou make great points! I don't think people should force designers to have plus-sive models because models are just there to sell the clothes. Its just the business.
ReplyDeleteGreat post!
I feel as though we are so backwards in this modern day. It's shocking that we still haven't overcome this issue of "fat vs. skinny."
ReplyDeleteIt's true that too fat is unhealthy, as too skinny is healthy. I guess being HEALTHY is the most important part. But that happy medium seems to hard to reach in the fashion industry... It's one extreme or the other.
QUIRKYEXPLOSION.blogspot.com
I hate it when models are labeled as skinny or plus-sized. After all, these labels are very subjective and depend on each person's point of view. A girl who is plus-sized to me may seem normal to another person. Its all so relative.
ReplyDeleteWhen magazines like V dedicate their entire issue to plus-size models, I have to say it sounds like a publicity stunt. I wish the fashion industry was a little more accommodating towards women of varied sizes and didn't use them as mere gimmick!
PS- Congrats on turning 18!
Deifnitely a touchy topic in fashion. But like Mimi said, a model is a model. They're supposed to sell the clothes and designers obviously think skinny tall models sell them the best. It's all advertising. We can't do much about it.
ReplyDeleteclothed much, a modest fashion blog
Garance definitely has a point. Using plus sized models in this period of time is only typically going to be a one hit wonder! As I've said before, it is hardly like the pictures of the plus sized are flattering, yes it shows curves and the reality, but in my eyes roll are not beautiful nor healthy.
ReplyDeleteGrazia's journalist definitely needs to take a deeper look into the world of fashion, and the use of plus sized models.
Good job I spotted this post, brilliant.
Ja'ime
www.tino.......
Hi girl..you're so sexy and pretty...here my first time visit to your cool blog and i can say that its the best blog i have visited after long time. Thank you. I'll have to go read up more on tweet backs thoug , regards
ReplyDeletesexy lita
Many thanks for sharing with us, the content is sexy and cool, here I also have one good news,I really appreciated it. Keep up the goodwork.
ReplyDeleteHey. Firstly the average size in the uk is actually a 16 so I don't see why people have a problem with using larger models and it bugs me so much she. Designers only go upto size 16 if that, also the teen brand jack wills which only goes upto a 14 is actually ridiculous, why about half the population who can't wear these clothes? They have limited places they can shop. Using supposedly plus size models is merely portraying a more honest picture of what the clients would look like and if they don't SUIT them they should design clothes which do,there should be size 8's to 18's to represent the nation more go honestly. Also, plus size models are not overweight which I think is an extremely rude insinuation, I mean to them even size 8 is plus size. Buy still I am a size 12-14 not overweight but I think that should be the general size of a plus size model being perfectly healthy, maybe they take plus size too literally as go too extreme thinking all size 18's and above but if size 12-14 is too big to be a normal model but too small to be plus size I think that should be the compromise as it represents the world and the country better.
ReplyDeleteWoah what a rant. Love the blog. X
ReplyDelete